Transcript:
Robin: I thought we could just chat a little bit and let those watching this learn more about you and about your history with Esalen massage. I have known you for about 30 years, Peggy, and I think you were practicing massage long before I met you. How long have you been doing Esalen massage?
Peggy: I started in about 1970 when I joined the massage crew at Esalen, so that’s 53 years.
Robin: Amazing.
Peggy: Over five decades, plus.
Robin: What is your trade secret Peggy? How have you been practicing massage for 53 years?
Peggy: Well, you have to love it. You have to really love the practice to stay there. You have to learn how to not burn out. Create good boundaries, create good physical and mental practices for myself that have helped me to stay centered and grounded and to stay in my truth about where I am for the work.
If I’m feeling burned out to take some space. I actually took a year off, not completely, I think I did one day a week when your mom and I had a little shop in Big Sur. That was when I turned 65, and I thought, well, this is a nice time to take a break. So I did, I took a break, and that was wonderful. You know what, I went right back to it as soon as we sold the store, full time. So, it’s just become part of me over the years. It’s part of who I am at this point.
I love the work, and I love learning, I am constantly learning. Not only from massage, but I study outside of massage. Not so much massage technique or massage practices, but other practices that really help me, like movement, meditation, psychology. All of the areas that relate in their own way to the practice. To be a really good practitioner, and by that I mean to be somebody who can be present with compassion, you have to do your own work. Your own work is psychological as well as physical. There’s a whole area of conscious staying with myself that I practice, and I think that’s one of the reasons I’ve been able to sustain my practice and keep my interests because I keep exploring practices that support me.
Robin: I love that. You were just talking about the internal practice when you show up to do massage, and I’m imagining that’s part of what you’re doing when you’re doing massage is that there’s an internal dialogue or practice…or what are you doing internally? What if you’re having a really hard day? How do you show up for somebody else?
Peggy: You turn lemon into lemonade. You take whatever those feelings are, it’s energy, it’s feelings. If I’m having a hard day, and I’ve got some difficult feelings in there, if I can transmute that energy from a negative to a positive force. I do that by becoming present, that’s the work, being present for whatever shows up, being present for myself and my client. That’s the practice. That’s the beauty, and maybe the secret, of Esalen massage, the presence of the practitioner.
Robin: I love that. When I teach Esalen massage, I talk about these “cornerstones” of Esalen massage. Presence is one of them, I think, that foundational desire and commitment to being present.
Peggy: Yes, and you have to learn and develop ways to do that for one’s self. For everybody that can look a little bit different, but it’s there. It’s probably the most important piece of what we do: showing up fully and remaining present. In that way, we can constantly be monitoring what’s going on with our client and connecting. What I’m really looking for is a connection, by that I mean, a resonance between us. The energetic calm that I bring to the session is what I’m trying to transmit to my client so they can go into parasympathetic relaxation. By being present I’m more able to do that, I’m more able to connect. I’m more able to see where they are and find my way there. For me, the moment of the massage that I love the most is when I really feel they’re there, they’ve got it and they sank in. It’s no longer anxiety or thoughts, they’re there, they’ve come into their body. That way the body can heal itself, which is basically what happens when a person allows that level and depth of relaxation, healing happens.
Robin: I love that, Peggy. You just spoke to how presence comes in different ways. I’m curious how you get present? What is your technique that really helps you drop into presence? I know for me sometimes it can be to bring myself into the sensation of my hands, or hearing the sounds of the environment can help me get present. What are your ways that help you get present?
Peggy: I think for me, it’s entering my body and the sense of feeling embodied and grounded. By that I mean, really connected to myself physically, connected to the earth that’s supporting me, and then connected to my breath. The breath always brings me home. It’s in meditation, it’s my anchor. Although, I also use sound as an anchor, but not so much in massage, it’s really more about breath. I’m checking myself to see that I’m breathing, that I’m not holding my breath, because then I’m energetically holding back. I’m coming back to that all the time. I’m always feeling, “what am I feeling inside, am I getting some kind of a sensation and an intuition?” Where am I going to pick that up? I’m going to pick that up in my own body. It’s a constant check in with myself.
Robin: I love that, Peggy. I’d love to go back and hear a little about the beginnings of you and Esalen massage. What drew you to Esalen? What drew you to doing massage?
Peggy: Well, maybe massage is what drew me actually. I don’t think I’ve ever answered that question in that way, but as you asked me, I was remembering the first time I went there. That was in 1967. I was living in New York City, so that was a big leap to go from Manhattan to Esalen. I had a massage, and it was so transformative. I had never been touched in that way. Well, I had never taken my clothes off and gone into a hot tub with strangers no less. All of that was new, and weird, and exciting, and fun and wonderful. The massage was so amazing to me. I just went into this altered state, and I took that home with me. I kept coming back to Esalen for the next two years until I moved there. There were many other things that drew me, it was the end of the sixties, and there was a whole cultural revolution going on. Esalen was at the forefront of thinking and freedom and new ways of creating a life. I was drawn to the culture and all of that. When I got there, I went to work in the kitchen for a few months, and that was a disaster. I was not a cook, as Rachel will vouch. After a few months in there, I just started doing massage. Whoever was in charge at that time, I think it was Janet Letterman, I said, “I’d like to do massage.” She said, “well, what’s stopping you?” and I said “I don’t know, nothing’s stopping me, let’s go.” She hired me, and there were only a few of us doing massage at that time. That was way back in 1970. I just started learning on the job. I had taken some classes with Seymore and Storm and different people. I just went to work.
Robin: and there was no formal training at that time?
Peggy: Gosh, no. So different than now. The training was, you get a few massages and take a few classes. The classes were informative and I learned, and got the basics. For me, it was something that felt really natural, and I loved doing it right from the beginning. I thought, what a beautiful way to connect with people, to give to people, and to be in service. I just felt, there was something about coming home for me in that work that was very deep. I think that was the hook that got me in and kept me in. I loved it right from the beginning.
Robin: I love that, I love that story. And then you stayed in Big Sur. You’ve stayed in Big Sur all these years.
Peggy: I did, yes. I lived at Esalen for about 10 years. I married a man who I met there who was working as an artist in the Art Barn. Our children were born there, two of them. He had a son who lived with us as well. He had a big farm next to the Art Barn, and he did his work there. He raised animals, and we had a great time there. The Gazebo was started, so my children had a two minute walk to their preschool. It was really idyllic in many ways. We were lucky enough to be able to buy our own place, and in 1980 we moved out.
I stayed and it’s crazy how it just evolved and I just stayed there and kept doing massage and kept studying, raised my kids there. It’s a wonderful place to raise children in that environment. There was so much that they could experience. People from all over the world were coming there. Actually more so in those days, we had a lot more people from all over the world, from Europe in particular. We had that wonderful preschool, it was quite perfect for us at that time. Then we just moved on to our own place, and it looks like I’m a “lifer” here.
Robin: It is idyllic, having a little bit of that experience having my daughter there and going to the Gazebo school for a few years. I know just how wonderful it is to have that community around you, where you don’t really have to go anywhere. You can feel that support, being fed, having your children watched over by people you trust. It was just so profound.
Peggy: Just the community, I love the connections in the community. It of course changes, it’s changed a lot over the years, but however it’s changed, it’s still community. I think when people come to Esalen and they’re just so taken with the place, I think part of that experience is that they’re experiencing community in a really wonderful way that they don’t have in their daily life. We’re herd animals, we need that community, we need each other. When people get to Esalen, they feel that. For those of us that have been there a long time, we’re engaged in it, not on the daily level and not all the time with everything that’s going on. The feeling is there. You feel held in a way. I guess for me, that’s been part of it too, just being a part of the Esalen community. I’ve felt very held and supported in different ways over the years. Definitely in my work. As my work evolved, they supported me in new things that I’m doing now that have come out of my years of massage practice. It’s been a wonderful ride.
Robin: Beautiful, and just to jump forward again to you’re coming to Asheville in a few weeks. You’re going to be teaching, and it is going to be an introductory course, but also you have so much wisdom to share around sustainability and longevity in a massage practice. I’d love to hear a few teasers about that. I know you spoke to being present, but what else has supported you over these years in doing massage for so long?
Peggy: The presence, of course. My meditation work, that’s been super important. I’d love to share some of that. I’d like to share the grounding practices that work for me. Also, I have a yoga practice, I’m not a yoga teacher, it’s some of my own stretches and asana. Movement, every morning, I do that, every single day. I walk. I keep physically active and physically strong, and I think that’s a big piece of it. We can do some movement, stretching, grounding, and meditation. All of these supportive things that really hold me as I do this work. Also, working with our mind. It’s very important in this work to be open, to be compassionate to all beings, whoever shows up. To be able to work with people without judgment, and that takes some work on one’s self a lot. We do that naturally, and that’s what humans do: we like it, we don’t like it, we judge. So learning how to deal with our own minds and all of the things that come up for us in engaging with another human being in a deep way. Those are things that we can touch on, and look at.
Robin: I love that. I imagine, I know as a massage instructor, I get those questions a lot. “How do I deal with this client who really triggers me or challenges me or isn’t open?” All of the things that we label as a challenging client but really it's just our own internal way we’re thinking about or engaging with somebody who might not be as open to our touch or to communication, whatever it is that we may have to offer.
Peggy: Those are our growing edges, that’s where we learn. It’s wonderful when you can find a way to connect with somebody who’s difficult to connect with.
Robin: Awesome, well I think it’s going to be a great class. Just to wrap it up, I’d love to hear, when you think about your whole experience of Esalen massage, are there any moments that stand out to you, experiences or classes you took that were pivotal or deeply influential? I know that’s a big loaded question of 56 years of studying massage, maybe just whatever bubbles to the surface for you. Some impactful moment or teaching.
Peggy: I jump back to the beginning with that question. Just giving one of my first massages where a client was an older gentleman, and he was in tears. At the end of the session, his eyes welled up and he was so moved. I thought, “Wow. There is power in this work.” That was really important for me, because it gave me a sense of the depth that we’re working with and the human emotional fragility and how, especially for someone who hasn’t been touched in a kind way, can change a person’s reality. I think that’s what happened for him. I just imagine in his history, he didn’t have the nurturing and love that he should have had. So being touched in that way was a very deep experience. It moved me very deeply. When I think back, a lot of the early experiences were very pivotal. Also in the learning, watching Seymore Carter, who is sadly not with us anymore, he was a very fiery masculine man, and yet when he touched people, when he approached a client on the table, there was a softness and a yin side of him that emerged that was so beautiful. That was very eye opening to me. I could see that this work wasn’t just for women, who are naturally nurturing, but that anybody can do this if they can allow that softness in themselves. That was a big lesson for me too.
Robin: Beautiful. Thank you so much Peggy. I really look forward to seeing you. I just really appreciate and love hearing your stories, so thank you.
Peggy: Thank you, Robin. I can’t wait to see you too and all of your students
Join Peggy for an incredibly enriching and empowering course: Introduction to Esalen®️ Massage: Increasing Longevity through Presence in Asheville June 29-30, 2023.
